[Andy Graves]

I have been quietly watching both the SFA and FabNet and reading the mis-information, contradicting marketing and overall perceptions from each website. What a bunch of crap from all sides.

When will we figuer out that we are all countertop companies.

Got a question for ya. Let’s say you installed a countertop 10 years ago for Mrs. Jones. Now she comes back because of your quality and service but she wants another countertop material? Doesn’t matter which you installed first, do you offer what she wants today?

I see us bitching about nonsense. Being a solid surface fabricator first, I have partnered with quartz and stone fabricators to offer “My Customers” the materials they desire.

How much longer will we continue to club each other on the head about issues that don’t matter to the customer. Can’t all fabricators see the value in all products, find a high ground and work together to supply customers with valid information, put together by countertops experts.

Just my views

[Luc Bellavance]

Amen!

I am now exploring alternatives like concrete and wood – Why? – because the clients I work with are asking for it and if I cannot provide it someone else will and they are my customers because of the trust they have in my relationship with them.

Anyone every worked with these folks http://www.spekva.dk/?lang=uk ? They have distribution out of Atlanta, GA in the USA market? Sorry for jackin your thread Andy…

[Gene McDonald]

Andy, I understand your harmonius attempt to make us all get along but some of refuse to sell everytype of countertop material that somone Invents or discovers,Stop reading the other sites threads if they are pissing you off, Some of us werent raised right with manners,etc. Dont let em make you angry, Its funny people are starting to argue with people about argueing, The Sone Site is a stone site, period. I would rather respect them for doing what they choose, not jumping on every money train that comes by. Its like going into a catholic church and telling them to give Buddism a try, look we are good at it and if you think countertops are all the same and should be seperate that is fine, I am just trying to make a point that Religion is religion, but there are many differnt types, hence like us there is Countertops and some of us want to stick to maybe one type or two, and some want three thousand types…good for them, the thing is who cares??? None of them guys represent the whole Stone Industry and neither do some of us represent the whole SS industry, its just a few people playing ping-p[ong and others are watching. I am getting into other surfaces myself, im not getting into granite because its everywhere, i hate competition, I dont want to even stael business from granite guys, thats one of the reasons, Master a few things maybe is not such a bad idea, rather than know a little of all the 16 types i count today that can be made into countertops….Mark my word Andy…this thread is going to a pissing contest in itself, your gonna have the peole that dont give a hoot who arent even affected by the ping-pong game, Your gonna have the loving “Cant we all just get along crowd, and your gonna have a new breed of thought process…lets just let it flow….I know we all love each other ….i for one love everyone on this site…some i love to shake hands with and some i love to ……..,

[Norm Walters]

Gene, I love you too, but could ya separate that $hit into paragraphs.

[Tom M]

Norm, I’m not sure it didn’t technically belong in just one paragraph. Scary brilliant, I say.

Gene,

To take it a step further, I think that expanding your fabrication line should be small steps. As a lam/ss guy, it would be better for me to learn how to fabricate, say, ShetkaStone or Richlite, maybe Alkemi, rather than heard and shiny, concrete or the glass inlaid stuff.

[Gene McDonald]

Tom, I offer Shetka stone, but havent sold any yet 69 sq ft wholesale pricing before i have it shipped,Plus you send them the template and then they send you the parts to seam up. Paperstone Im looking into , I just got the Vetrazzo Certified Fabricator test Kit in the mail, its cementix stuff with glass, It only comes outta California, & Minnesota.I’ll just have the certification in case we get a MFG here in Florida.

It wouldnt be green to ship to expensive slabs on a truck from CA. to Florida, then pay for the slab and S&h, then i hafta fab it and install it, it would be Green to me. Green is not so much a noun as it is a practice.I am going green, so i have been investigating other materials to help in this movement, i still have to say Avonites recycled Solid Surface is the best bang for the buck, plus with all the other FDA & NSF approvals it just help compliment it, i am in study for my LEED AP test and learning alot.

Norm, i spaced it for ya….

[David Gerard]

Gene, have you messed with concrete counters before? We had 4 guys here doin it but 1 dropped out. On the occasion I bid against them I kick their butts especialy on the sills. I have yet to see a top on a kitchen work space not develop the “Patina look.” On islands and other non prep areas I have seen an admired some great work by my good friend Leovait.com We go round about the sealing aspect in a prep area. I still don’t get how concrete is green. Take so much energy to kiln dry it, some places burn tires to do so. I do recognize you being an artist, this kind of raw material could be fun. Look forward to hearing about it, meanwhile I continue to wait for my samples of Himacs Eden series

[Gene McDonald]

David, the Vetrzzo co

[Gene McDonald]

oops, David, I dont want to mess with Concrete tops either, but I am investigating them being i am going green, the Vetrzzo is nice stuff, but I dont want to pay for the shipping. Im also going to look at recycled glass, most of these new Green materials are better to just template send them the CAD or the actual glued up luan strips,etc and then you just install it with a matching silicone/Epoxy seam. I guess just like some of the Quartz people i know do, they just template pay for fabrication then install. Vetrzzo has 10 year warranty…not too good in stain resistant though, I am not going to sell every single top Green offers, i just want to investigate them and then decide what would be best for my business

I am not fabricating items that can sell, but rather thinking about selling the items i fabricate…the consumers need to do some research, before coming to our shops or phones, they are forcing me to say something negative when they ask about a material i do not offer…and they know it….II an telling them now to do their own research online and look what my website offers, If i could explain my products pros & cons in three mintues , i would do it, but ya cant, after they search out the material differences,then go out and go to a shop that has what you want customer…..

I just thought of a new idea for some of us COUNTERTOP MATERIAL CONSULTATION 500.00 per hour, price includes top ten comparrisson sheets throught the world, website links, material testing results, fact sheets, etc.money up front and will be returned if you purchase 5000.00 or more of service from Refresh Interiors,Inc.

[Mike Jones]

Gene, come on over, I’ll tool ya up for stone real quick.

BTW, we’re getting a lot of requests as of late and selling quite a few diamond resin pads specifically formulated for concrete countertops.

Like Andy said, It’s COUNTERTOPS…give em what they want.

[David Gerard]

I don’t know if any of you share this type of small town life as I have. I have lots of customers that I have built many things for including boats and other off track items. I am very close friends with 90% of them that is to say we get invited to any and all functions they may put on at the place we may have just finished I find myself in those large gatherings at parties,potlucks and art openings disscussing my trade( they bring it up not me) they want ideas and advice. I can see my wife’s eyes roll as soon as someone approches me because she is the one who handles their accounts for their const. projects, her eyes say “run…run…run for your life!” Anyway my world is completly saturated in building,building,building When the talk of counters comes up the first thing I ask is What are you interested in, and if they have an idea then I ask what do you know about that material.(never a hard sell from me) To be in so many new houses all the time and to see how diff materials do keeps me in the know. I love it when I hear the pottery or wine glass shatter on the already very stained concrete top, I bite my tounge and wait for a call. Some things just sell them selves. The recycled glass would go over very big here in “the little cosmic hamlet by the sea”. Did I mention I love small town life!

[David Gerard]

Forgot to make my point(too much coffee) In a small town whether the customer made the choice or not when products don’t perform your name is on the line, Ive already been down that road ,things get circulated in a funny way in small town life. I tend to stick with what is proven and I never have to find myself defending my work. I’m sorry, I cant by into products I don’t belive in just to give a customer what they want, it’s very different in a small town. I do however subscribe to the fact that we are all in this together.

[Gene McDonald]

See David, thats my point as well, we are pissing in the same hole…I am investigating and doing my own testing…not biology and scientific, stuff, but fabrication, Installations, Dust..tooling, marketing…Risk of call backs, I would much rather have a few specific shops in town that act as an alliance then every single shop selling all 16 types of countertop material. if the customer wants a concrete top go over there, Unless i have time to make sure it is a hygenic, quality product . and if i find it ok and can control the quality i might offer that to clients…if it is a form of “Green- washing” and is setting me up for a black eye, i wont risk it, i’ll only risk the referral to the shop down the street (so they can pay the bills,not take their work too, cause of what a customer wants)I will say, sorry i havent enough experience with Concrete, I can fabricate it, but I am not sure how it will hold up in the Certification process for those who think this material will get them LEED Credits

[Ron Clark]

I tend to agree with both David and Gene…

I like the idea of alliances with other local fabricators and currently use someone I feel does quality work with cultured marble, butcher block, solid surface, and concrete.

I also need to watch myself as far as the small town thing goes and I caution the buyer as best my knowleage allows on the different material types. Most of my cabinet friends can do laminate and if I am dealing with a builder on a tight budget who will find someone else to do the laminate they want or cultured marble bathrooms then I like to offer them a solution. Same goes with some of the designers and their clients… they want concrete I make sure they know the ups and downs and try to solve their problem.

I have been known to recently recommend solid surface for bathroom vanities over cultured marble because my friend down the road likes to sell his drop, does a much tighter neater fit, and it is easier to refinish down the road. The last client that wanted concrete didn’t want to wait 4 months on the guy so I fabbed a plain edge Cesaerstone that had the same color as the concrete, I did 4 baths and a large tub surround and she waited on the concrete guy for her fireplace hearth. Most all of my attempts to do the recycled glass requests have failed due to the high cost of the GREEN material.

So whats my point? I don’t want to do it all either but I want to offer a solution to the people that come to me because of trust and an expectation of getting their needs met in one place.

My interest in concrete inhouse is for the use in outdoor kitchens and shapes that I don’t want to handle in other materials. Pour in place in an outdoor setting makes some sense to me. Do I recommend the use of concrete for the average kitchen? The answer is NO. Would I consider it for one used in a rustic setting by a designer that will not be used like a kitchen countertop? The answer would be YES.

Are you guys getting my drift on this?

[David Gerard]

Kevin, the out door concrete counter great idea. Hose that baby off and Bobs your uncle. Leo Vait has done several concrete tops that were adjacent to the beautiful fireplaces and hearths he created for some of my projects as well as others. Great place for the stuff (as well as others),mixed with local stone. Thought I had some pics but they are buried in the disk pile somewhere. Anyway I here ya. And as my ships pilot friend says ” you are only as good as your last docking” sort of applies to the small town senerio………… to some degree.

[Author]

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