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A Corian fabricator I spoke to recently told me that there were (at least) two different standards for being an “authorized” Corian fabricator. According to him, there is a “distributor” authorization (which is, as you might guess, awarded and administrated by the Corian distributor), and then there is the “factory” authorization, which requires a site visit by a factory representative and some degree of training at a factory facility.
This is the first I’ve heard of such a thing. Anybody else aware of these two levels of certification, or is this guy just making it up? If it’s for real, how would one tell which certification a given fabricator has?
gb
Followup question: I just went to the Corian website, and looked again at their Locator feature:
http://www2.dupont.com/Surfaces/en_US/where_to_buy/store_locator.html
I just noticed that it is a RETAIL STORE locator! I guess that means that it doesn’t necessarily find all FABRICATORS in your given area. Maybe as a customer/consumer, the difference is irrelevant, since we would need to PURCHASE the Corian as well as have it fabricated/installed? Or am I missing out here? Is there another way to find a duly-authorized Corian fabricator, who can also sell me product?
Thanks,
gb
Good question George.
As I understand it, most manufactures do use two systems to get people certified. I took the factory training insisted upon by my distributor. Others may have had years of experience in a solid surface shop without actually being certified, and might be able to attend a day long seminar held by a distributor and a factory technician.
I received my Swanstone certification that way, but it was after quite a bit of experience in solid surface.
Other companies will honor Avonite, Corian and ISSFA certifications. The better ones will ask for a copy of the actual certification. I believe Royal stone has a training program as well and I am sure there are others that I am ignorant of.
Speaking only for Avonite, the certification does expire but will be renewed if you are in good standing with Avonite and the distributor and have little problems with warrantee problems. If I am correct, the factory trained guys like me get an “advanced fabrication certification”. Then there is the master fabricator certification, you have to have more tools, bigger better equipment, have a minumum number of jobs per month in the last year ( translation, a lot of experience). With Avonite, it gives the consumer added warrantee for the work of the fabricator, not just for the material.
Personally, I never pursued the Master certification, although I would more than qualify for it. There is only one in our state and he is no longer selling Avonite, so no competitive reason to do so.
The fabricators certification should be posted somewhere in the showroom or office, but many don’t post them so just ask about it or get a recomendation from the Corian people. They should be posted on their website.
Gee, GeeBee…
All I can tell is my story. I completed the ISSFA ITEC class. It was not long a Corian rep stopped by my shop. As he was painting this awesome picture, and sugar flowing out his mouth, when it suddenly turned sour when he told me, if he sold me Corian, I could not buy any other brand, well maybe a small percentage. After showing him the door, his final words was, If I did not sell Corian, I would never make it. Well little did he know, Avonite and Staron embraced me and became my business partner, and I enjoy selling their product.
I’m not sure why I have heard about more fabricators that no longer sell Corian, than those that have started selling it. I have heard of a program a few years ago where Dupont had this program that was rewarding loyal fabricators only to stop the program before they had to pay up? I’m sure someone can give more details on this? Of course this is just hearsay…maybe someone can give more details.
KC
K.C.,
One of their salesmen told me something about if you didn’t increase sales each year, they could back charge more money for the sheets I had already purchased that year. That was there way of telling me that if I sold their product, forget about selling anything else. I do know one shop that sells Corian and any thing else they darned please, but they are on of the really big companies that can’t be pushed around. Corian guys also told me that they limit the number of shops that sell it in a given area. Plus having to do the high strength cutout for cooktops is a p.i.a.
High Strenght Cutouts??? All my training I have not heard that one, can you explain? ISSFA trained me with the corner blocks, rounded edges/tape ect sanding perfectly… maybe I do it, just never heard that phase…
It is in my corian manual and the staron salesman insisted that we use it since they consider themselves corian clones. It is like you mentioned, rounded corner and edges, except each corner has a small circle cut out of it. Imagine your router bit getting to the corner, then making a small round circle at the inside corner and then getting back on track. Or take a forester bit and drill an offset hole at each corner of the cutout. Works okay untill you get that cooktop that has a very small lip that won’t cover the extra hole.
I had quite a discussion with the Staron guy about the practice. His explanation was something about stress and heat dissipation. I understand the round corner/stress/airplane window explanation but adding an extra hole doesn’t make any sense to me. He never gave me an actual fabrication manual so I think I’ll check the one posted on this site to see if it is there.
Yes, download the staron manual from the resources page. Chapter 2, number 22 on the list of rules, page 15 of the manual is the first mention, then in chapter 13, page 89.
I just scanned the manual, need to spend some time with it soon.
Al, Ok we are on the same page here. I was trained there is no other way to do a cooktop. The corner nib, has to be only 1/8 inch into corner/ Looks bigger that it is, but I have never had a cooktop that never covered.
I use the 3 1/2 inch corner blocks, all edges 45deg and 2 layers of heat tape. I route the edges with a 1/8 r bit and sand the entire inside edge to 600grit (SIA). Lenny Elbon told this story of a guy overseas, that never used a corner reinforcing block and never had a failure. Lenny asked him what his secret was, he sanded all his edges to a mirror finish. Think of a scratch in SS the exact same as a scratch by a glass cutter on glass. It will break at the scratch. No scratch, no break!
we were trained to do about the same, 4″ blocks, square corners okay, one layer of hear tape, but it had to be avonite’s heat tape ($$$$$$) and no sanding on the inside but of course it was routered out. I’ll check the corian manual to see what they wanted, but the staron guy wanted a little more than an eighth of an inch when he set us up. I thought he said 3/4 inch dia, or 3/8″. Maybe I am wrong.
Ditto on them scratches, we’ve never had any problems with cooktop cuttouts, but we usually hit them with the 80 micron for a few seconds. Might think about doing a little more.
.
My Corian rep use to give ma a quota of how much Corian that I needed to sell in order to get a rebate. At first I thought what the hell, if I do it fine and if not oh well. Then when I thought I might actually reach my quota THEY RAISED IT, no kidding in mid stream they decided it was too low and they increased it to an unreachable amount. That was many years ago and now when someone comes in with a quota program I tell them I want nothing to do with it.
The last time I had a problem with one of our jobs with a crack at the cooktop was before we started to do the corner blocks. I think it is worth the extra time it takes to insure there are no problems. We try very hard to do things by the book, or in most cases even more than they call for. I believe this is why we have no fabricator errors when it comes to warrantee claims.
Shane
You guys have my sympathy, if Corian is really doing that “thou shalt sell no other countertop than mine” stuff. That really stinks. I thought there was a LAW against that kind of practice; many years ago, JBL audio products got their hands slapped for doing that kind of thing with retailers. Hey, if your product is the best on the market, it should AUTOMATICALLY take over the fabricator’s sales. If it ISN’T, then get back to work on your product and/or pricing. (I’m looking at YOU, DuPont…)
With regard to the cooktop cutouts: in many materials, cracks (that is, existing ones) can often be stopped by drilling a hole at the “leading” end of the crack (i.e. the crack is propagating from an opening or chip, and into the rest of the material.) The hole interrupts the “grain” that the crack is propagating along, and relieves the stress that is generated when the material on either side of the crack physically moves away from the material on the other side. I would think that Corian (& Staron, etc.) would be an “anisotrope” (essentially meaning “no grain”, and not stronger in any one direction than any other), but apparently there IS some kind of grain that cracks can propagate along. (Obviously, things like natural granite and wood have PLENTY of grain for cracks!) Probably a corner of a square-cornered cutout looks like a “crack”, and fueled by the constant heating and cooling from a cooktop, it would tend to crack in the corners if there wasn’t a round “hole” (or 1/4 hole) to dissipate the stress.
Are the “corner blocks” you’re talking about made of the same material as the countertop, and glued to the countertop? Or are they wood blocks, like an underlayment?
BTW, what’s an “80 micron”? Sounds cool…
gb
It’s all about radii. By drilling the hole at the end of the crack you create a radius. Any radius will dissipate stress.
The double radiius on the corner blocks of hob cut-outs acts in the same way – the larger the radius, whether a true radius or not, the better it will be at resisting stress.
Re DuPont Certification: In the UK if you have been approved by DuPont you gain membership of DuPont’s Quality Network and this entitles you to offer the 10 year Warranty. You can also buy your material either directly from DuPont’s warehouse in Belgium or (at a slightly higher price from the local distributor’s warehouse). Fabricators who are not part of the Quality Network can buy from the local Distributor but are NOT covered by the Warranty. This does not stop some of them claiming that their work is covered – it’s not, though DuPont will generally err on the side of keeping the end-user happy.
This issue of Authorisation or Certification is a touchy one. The Certified fabricator works (usually) to the very highest standards taking extra time to ensure the job conforms in all respects to DuPont’s laid down standards. The uncertified guy may not feel the same constraints and can accordingly undercut the certified guy.We are presently pressing DuPont to differentiate between the different types of Fabricator so that the consumer can make an informed choice and always choose the Fabricator who will stand by their work and who will be backed up by DuPont if there is the need.
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