[Mory Ludwick]

Wouldn’t you know it that 3M has a patent on Hook It 2 and their sand paper is 3 times the money. Today I ran across an old auto painter and we were talking about sandpaper. We started talking about curly cues, that is the little circular marks we sonetimes leave on countertops. I was at the paint store to buy sandpaper for a high gloss top, I usually go up to 3000 with no type of liquid polish. After speaking with him I bought an interface pad and went with Hook It 2. He bet me that by using Hook It 2 I would not get any curly cues, pig tails or swirls. After completing the top, I found he was right. So I asked why didn’t everyone else switch. 3M has a patent, that sucks. I will continue buying Hook It 2 when we sell a high polish top. After all its well worth it, money in the bank.

Mory

[david d’agostino]

3 times the $ vs what Mory?? Regular Hookit? This post confuses me and I am the King of Micron…LOL The general rule of thumb with a Hookit II vs Hookit backing is the part that was generally on the abrasive is now on the pad and vice versa. Theory being that the pad lasts longer and the part that wears is in the back of the abrasive which is wearing front and back per say. What was the 3M sku on this? 268L…366L…768L…etc.

[Flex]

Mory, we sell a good share of Hookit II 3M micron but not for this alleviating the “curly cue” syndrome. And, it’s not 3 times any other abrasive unless I’m completely missing something here…

Dave

[Mory Ludwick]

Dave,

I know alot of people in the auto body industry and alot of shops that do showcar work. I trust these guys and they usually know what they are talking about. That is why they use Hook It 2, it doesn’t leave marks. As for the price, it is more expensive, at least up in this part of the country. I will post the SKU numbers tomorrow and remember these are auto body stores not solid surface sand paper suppliers.

( In general 3M sandpaper is alot more expensive than most brands).

Mory

[Reuben Hoff III]

Mory,

You think in your part of the state is bad, try out in mine with the cows. It is hard to even get people to get you prices for some of this stuff especially when it pertains to solid surface.

So does this hook it 2 create a longer pad life for the sanders, the stuff I currently use seems to have sandpaper flying across the room after about 10 top jobs? If it elimantes curly que and increases pad life that might be worth a look at for me.

[KCWOOD]

I use SIA pads and paper, not sure what it is called, but seems to adhere so much better than the 3m. just a slight touch and it grabs tight. I buy their pads for my Festool and Dynabrade Sanders. I use a 6 hole for the woodworking, it moves the holes in to the middle more, so one can sand various wood shapes without the paper tearing like it does with the 9 hole (on the edge) in the same application. I have a 1/4″ hard backer pad and also a soft pad they recommend for 280 grit and higher. BTW, Sia Blue is sized just like 3m’s micron. 280grit is all the same, no + or -. I use SIA yellow on the woodworking side, it does have grit variations. and at a lower cost.

KC

[By Design]

KC, sias blue may be “sized” like 3M…bit it aint micron. Nothing is. While most distributors certainly carry many lines of abrasives…a choice, when it comes to our SS customers, it’s about 95% Micron usage. Why? It works the same from the 1st pc to the 100th pc. As far as the + or – goes as it relates to conventional grit sandpaper, the fact of the matter is no 2 pieces of any brand…say 220 grit in Mirka, Rhyno, Norton, Sia, Festool, you name the brand…gives exactly the same scratch pattern. Darn close, but not the same. While I don’t think anyone has the time to see this scientifically…I have. I can put 2 pieces of any brand under a microscope and the peeks and valleys of the abrasive grain are not the same therefore creating a + or – factor. This is even more pronounced from brand to brand.One companies 220 may be anothers 240 grit or even 260. There’s a mathematical equation to this bit I don’t want to put the board to sleep.

Yes Mory, 3M Hookit II is 3 times and maybe 4 to 5 times more expensive than conventional abrasives but I took it you were holding that up vs 3M’s regular Hookit. Fact of the natter is that all 3M 366L 11 1/4″ Micron for the GEM sander is Hookit II. I can see why a company finishing show quality cars would use it. Bottom line: If it works…it works.

[Green Granite]

OK Mory, here’s a comparison on Hook 1 vs Hook 2 on 5″ NH 60 Micron (220g)

3M81923-5″ NH Hookit 60 Micron-$28.34 per 50pc. 268L or 366L

3M49723-5″ NH Hookit II 60 Micron-$34.50 per 50pc. 268L or 366L

Also, spoke with a body shop jobber supply guy today and he said that in Hookit II, he sees 3M 765L pushed a lot which is actually not micron but 3M’s purple abrasive in aluminum oxide.

Dave

[KCWOOD]

KC, sias blue may be “sized” like 3M…bit it aint micron. Nothing is.

Dave you are right. SIA is not 3m Micron, and that is a great thing for my applications. My 3m rep from Nashville came out when I got into SS. he introduced me to Micron, and after sanding several tops it was good, but expensive and didn’t seem to last long.

He saw all the paper i used for the woodworking and ordered me a full shop of samples. The sanding disk lost most of its grit when touched to the white oak, the wide belts would not track. He was really embarrased about the whole thing and said ever since they started making all the abrasives overseas, they were having problems. I did keep using the micron though. Then at Expo 2 yrs ago I met SIA and found out they are the largest global supplier of sandpaper. They are into anything and everything, swiss made, and have been for about 100 yrs now. For my application and the way I use it, their yellow line outlast any other I have tried for wood, and the SIA blue, well lets just say for the way I sand and the quality i expect it surpasses my expectations. And at 40.00/c it’s great on the bottom line.

[eric fecteau]

KC, $40.00 for what size, grit, backing and pc per box? Also, what size are your wide belts? And, did I read that correctly…3M put Micron abrasive on your wide belt or conventional 3M Abrasive?

I sell NO MICRON to woodworkers, only conventional grade.

dave

[Mory Ludwick]

Thanks Dave

Mory

[Reid Swanson]

You’re welcome Mory.

KC, okay, I see $40.00 per 100. Size & grit?

Dave

[KCWOOD]

SIA 6″Blue 6 or 9hole (For SS, sized like the micron/with anti static) 280grit $40 for 100 pcs their velcro. I know you don’t use Micron for wood, I tried their conventional stuff… whatever it might be. I use 25 x 60 wide belts for wood, cloth belts, conventional. I use 12″ disc, 4 x 132, 6×48, Fladder System, Occ.Spindle sander.

I used to use the 3M Softback sanding sponge 4.5X5.5 #02602 all the time in our finishing. When they started making them in England, the price went up and the pads did not last even half as long. Box of 20 went up to 26.00. Competitors are 25 pcs for 16.00 or 14.35 in case of 12 boxes.

I’m sure you have heard of SIA? They supply the worlds largest automakers, abrasives for the optical glass industry, scientific community, metalworking ect.

[ChinoHI]

KC, yes, I have heard of them…they’ve been in to sell me. I delined. I do not, as a rule, distribute products from companies that attempt to work both sides of the aisle. In other words, sell direct and through distributors. This does not mean that they don’t have a quality product. They do. But so do I…and now, they compete against me. Aint business grand! LOL

You will have samples in the mail immediately. Dang, I love the competitor spirit!

[Author]

Posts